Date Joined: Oct 11, 2011 19:28:34 GMT -5
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Post by romaniprincess on Jun 17, 2023 8:42:30 GMT -5
This could be a serious discussion so maybe people could try not throwing insults about.
For what it's worth the Bible is ambiguous on the role of women. Deborah for instance was one of the Judges of Israel and Jael freed the nation from the tyranny of Sisera.
But John is absolutely right that it does NOT say women shouldn't be allowed to vote (in fact it says nothing about voting at all which I suppose given the fact that it was written before democracy isn't surprising.)
I'm not a feminist; I'm not sure I'd call myself anti-feminist either. More of a gender equity advocate, I think.
Now John rightly says that there are different types of Christian.
In the same way there are different types of feminists.
The liberal feminists like Betty Friedan, Hannah Gavron,, Wendy McIlroy and others of that ilk have a VERY different take on women from the rad fems like Simone de Beauvoir, Andrea Dworkin and Catherine McKinnon. Friedan (IMO rightly) described them as 'female chauvinists.'
I don't believe in divorce but I'm not sure I'd make it illegal. Some sins IMO shouldn't be crimes against the law however much we might disapprove of them.
As for voting I think it's a fairly silly thing that this lady said.
But equally the rad fems come out with absolute nonsense with de Beauvoir spouting the most misogynistic rubbish ever (worse than Roosh and his mob) and McKinnon and Dworkin claiming that all heterosexual intercourse is rape and McKinnon going on to argue that a woman CAN'T consent to sex (or anything in her twisted universe.)
G K Chesterton once said that 'every heresy represents an overvaluation of some truth' and I think that's broadly true of feminism.
Gender equity IMO is the way to go and that can take different forms in individual cases. For example, if a husband is ill and his wife becomes the main breadwinner as a result I can't see how even the most rabid anti-feminist could object to that.
Equally I know people where rigid sexual stereotyping of roles was harmful. Some of my older friends went to school in the late 1960s and one was a boy who wanted to study Domestic Science but was turned down. He became a chef. Another was a girl who wanted to do woodwork and metalwork and was refused. She became an engineer.
So let's ditch the knee-jerk responses and look at things in a wider way.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 19:54:08 GMT -5
So should some men! True. John is an extremist and he really cannot be considered a christian. Jesus spoke about those who loudly called his name but were not real. But you know that already. The lady in the story was young with no kids talking about how women should not work and have children. I think we should wait a few years on her before jumping to conclusions. im2, you are no Christian, and you stand with people that hate Christ. You defend things God calls an abomination. You are Anti-Christ. You are worse than the Pharisees.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 19:56:09 GMT -5
I don't know where John read that story because all other data shows different. And there is nothing showing that more young people are becoming right wing extremists. But this is what extremists do, make up stories about how everybody else is turning to them. According of hank for example, the majority of blacks have now become Clarence Thomas. Which would be news for the majority of blacks I am not sure where I read the story, and it is a minor thing because I was not trying to prove anything with it. It was an observation. Perhaps I read it wrong, or it was some online poll? I am not arguing over it, and to be honest, I was surprised by it when I saw it. It didn't sound right.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 20:01:50 GMT -5
This could be a serious discussion so maybe people could try not throwing insults about. For what it's worth the Bible is ambiguous on the role of women. Deborah for instance was one of the Judges of Israel and Jael freed the nation from the tyranny of Sisera. But John is absolutely right that it does NOT say women shouldn't be allowed to vote (in fact it says nothing about voting at all which I suppose given the fact that it was written before democracy isn't surprising.) I'm not a feminist; I'm not sure I'd call myself anti-feminist either. More of a gender equity advocate, I think. Now John rightly says that there are different types of Christian. In the same way there are different types of feminists. The liberal feminists like Betty Friedan, Hannah Gavron,, Wendy McIlroy and others of that ilk have a VERY different take on women from the rad fems like Simone de Beauvoir, Andrea Dworkin and Catherine McKinnon. Friedan (IMO rightly) described them as 'female chauvinists.' I don't believe in divorce but I'm not sure I'd make it illegal. Some sins IMO shouldn't be crimes against the law however much we might disapprove of them. As for voting I think it's a fairly silly thing that this lady said. But equally the rad fems come out with absolute nonsense with de Beauvoir spouting the most misogynistic rubbish ever (worse than Roosh and his mob) and McKinnon and Dworkin claiming that all heterosexual intercourse is rape and McKinnon going on to argue that a woman CAN'T consent to sex (or anything in her twisted universe.) G K Chesterton once said that 'every heresy represents an overvaluation of some truth' and I think that's broadly true of feminism. Gender equity IMO is the way to go and that can take different forms in individual cases. For example, if a husband is ill and his wife becomes the main breadwinner as a result I can't see how even the most rabid anti-feminist could object to that. Equally I know people where rigid sexual stereotyping of roles was harmful. Some of my older friends went to school in the late 1960s and one was a boy who wanted to study Domestic Science but was turned down. He became a chef. Another was a girl who wanted to do woodwork and metalwork and was refused. She became an engineer. So let's ditch the knee-jerk responses and look at things in a wider way. My wife is not a feminist, and we have discussed some of the things you mentioned. I can tell you have been in the Bible and are open minded. I agree with much of what you said, and you are right about situations happening where the husband cannot work, and the wife picks up the slack and vice versa with regard to housework. In the Bible, it does tell wives to submit themselves to their own husbands in the same way as to the Lord, but it also mentions submitting to one another. If my wife needs something, I am not going to refuse to do it for her because it may be what is considered women's work. I have had to do much of the cooking and cleaning because she has been having health problems. There was a time where she drove team with me cross country. The husband's headship is in the scriptures, but we are to love our wives as Christ loved the church and gave himself for it.
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Date Joined: May 20, 2022 16:28:37 GMT -5
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Post by apple on Jun 17, 2023 20:15:10 GMT -5
Certain religious groups use religion to control women. Fact. The Jesus of the Gospels in no way subjugates women.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 20:18:25 GMT -5
Certain religious groups use religion to control women. Fact. The Jesus of the Gospels in no way subjugates women. How the heck would you know? Have you read the Bible even once? Do I need to give you scripture to prove you wrong?
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Date Joined: Aug 24, 2017 14:02:33 GMT -5
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Post by 🦍MAXX>ⓤ on Jun 17, 2023 20:27:58 GMT -5
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from a religious conviction.
~BLAISE PASCAL
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 20:36:09 GMT -5
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from a religious conviction. ~BLAISE PASCAL While I make no apologies for doing everything in my power to advance the agenda of the Christian Right, this comment has validity. We had the crusades, and we have seen what Muslim extremists have done. If someone is convinced of something, they will do whatever is necessary to defend it. Here is something for you to consider. You seem to believe this, and I am agreeing with you, and you have called Trump followers a cult religion. What might this cult do to defend him? I am not agreeing that we that support him are cultists, but if you really believe that, what might these religious extremists do?
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Date Joined: Aug 24, 2017 14:02:33 GMT -5
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Post by 🦍MAXX>ⓤ on Jun 17, 2023 21:33:36 GMT -5
Once evil always evil...
The greatest tool any god ever had was fear...
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 21:37:20 GMT -5
Once evil always evil... The greatest tool any god ever had was fear... You are religious and don't know it. You preach doctrine and fight for it, but your gods are the Democratic Party and Science. I doubt you will accept that, but that is okay. We know what people will do if they believe in something, so what might worshippers of Trump do, provided he is really their god as you say? If he is really a god to some, they can do really bad things to defend him. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
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Date Joined: Aug 24, 2017 14:02:33 GMT -5
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Post by 🦍MAXX>ⓤ on Jun 17, 2023 21:40:31 GMT -5
The aim of any religious movement is to inflict a malady on society, then offer the religion as a cure...
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 21:41:55 GMT -5
The aim of any religious movement is to inflict a malady on society, then offer the religion as a cure... The leftists and globalists are about order out of chaos. Sounds like a religion.
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Date Joined: May 20, 2022 16:28:37 GMT -5
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Post by apple on Jun 17, 2023 21:59:40 GMT -5
Once evil always evil... The greatest tool any god ever had was fear... Indeed. Fear is the best tool in the belt.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 22:01:03 GMT -5
Once evil always evil... The greatest tool any god ever had was fear... Indeed. Fear is the best tool in the belt. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
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Date Joined: Aug 24, 2017 14:02:33 GMT -5
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Post by 🦍MAXX>ⓤ on Jun 17, 2023 22:03:31 GMT -5
Since the beginning of human existence they have worshipped over 18,000 different deities including animals...
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Date Joined: May 20, 2022 16:28:37 GMT -5
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Post by apple on Jun 17, 2023 22:04:10 GMT -5
Indeed. Fear is the best tool in the belt. Be afraid. Be very afraid. No thank you. Fear does not control my life. TYVM but I will pass.
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Date Joined: Aug 24, 2017 14:02:33 GMT -5
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Post by 🦍MAXX>ⓤ on Jun 17, 2023 22:07:10 GMT -5
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 22:23:56 GMT -5
Here is something interesting about Pearl Davis. In 2017, she worked for Democratic State Senator Tom Cullerton of Illinois. Now she doesn't think women should vote. Could she have been disillusioned by the process because the man she worked for was yet another corrupt Democrat? Cullerton was indicted on 41 counts of embezzlement and conspiracy related to his alleged participation in a ghost payroll scheme while he was a member of the Illinois General Assembly. In 2022, he pled guilty and was sentenced to 1 year and 1 day in prison. I never imagined this story would lead to more corrupt Democrats. Funny how that happened. The Democrat Party is so corrupt, now I am tripping over their corrupt politicians without trying.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 22:27:56 GMT -5
Let's consider this another way. Is the idea that nothing became something and fish became monkeys and monkeys became men more plausible than creationism? My point being that there is nothing more intellectual or intelligent in the monkey to man theory than God created everything in 6 days. I find the creation account less hard to believe.
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Date Joined: May 29, 2020 20:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by John on Jun 17, 2023 22:30:52 GMT -5
Be afraid. Be very afraid. No thank you. Fear does not control my life. TYVM but I will pass. The way some of you have been behaving, it seems like you are terrified of Trump. Just saying. He is literally causing you to lose your collective minds.
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